As a newcomer to the Community, I am grateful for any help, to get started. I understand I must apply myself, because...I can't have someone always holding my hand. I am embarrassed to ask for help some of the time...and had kinda a bad response or two when I first became a member here. I know better, but still...it affects you, and I'll find myself struggling more on my own. On one hand that's good...as (I think) the intent of this thread implies.
From a newcomers perspective...this is ONE SCARY community. Not because of the members, or occasional miscommunications, or bruised feelings. The depth of the technology is daunting, and the scope and grasp of will I or can I achieve a level of competance? You lay out lots of money wanting what the ADS say you'll have, but after you open the box, you begin to quickly realize you have gone WAY over your head!!! You feel like ....a dummy.
I have read responses from some members here, who have opened the box, and easily assimilated this tool into their gift of gear. There are people like me...who only in the last few years...FINALLY gave in and bought a computer....OMG. My first 6 months....strike that...my first year figuring out the computer was HELL for me...and sitting glued to the phone on hold for HOURS trying to undo my mistakes....or even ask the simple questions I could not grasp from a book. Maybe there are many lurkers out there with a feeling of being overwhelmed by this techno stuff too.
May I state...had I not come here with a thick skin...I would have been bruised away, early on. Along those lines....if a newcomer arrives and asks a question...and gets no response...even much less a WELCOME....thats as bad as a kik in the groin...or a dispairing emptiness.
I still do not understand much of what many of you have learned to take for granted. I am slacking off trying...because I have a few patches created by Dr. Mike and some others...and have tweeked a few ....and I'm presently just enjoying some basic success. I'll be hurting and embarrassing myself again soon, in an effort to advance. But, I at least feel closer to many people here, and confident I'll ask the right questions, and continue to develop some skills. I feel like the ugly little brother in the basement who gets the bucket of fishheads....so I joke around more. I can't offer much help GNX-wise...but I can assist in many other areas, or try to loosen a few ties around here.
That being my final point. Lets enjoy ourselves a tad bit...and reflect the joy music brings our lives. Be creative as well as critical. Realize...the tough love...or NO U Dummy...works when it's offered with pointing out the positive things with it...and ending on encouragement. Yes I think we should all benefit together...not struggle alone. But...I walk away from this thread realizing, and affirming...I need to read those tutorials and ask the questions, and develop the skills so maybe I can give something back in kind one day.
I don't mind saying either...I love you guys....like a brother. You ROCK !!
I have a rule that if posts go beyond 6 lines I disregard them. I see it more as point of time management than anything else so I can spend time playing my guitar...This post is antagonizing, negative, and depressing.. Go play your guitars....
I started this thread after noticing that user patch contributions have taken a nose dive after 2 events. One was the move to the new board format, and the other was the supermodel release.
The scientific method might show all 3 events mutually exclusive with a cause and effect theory invalid.
...This post is antagonizing, negative, and depressing.. Go play your guitars....
Is it really? I don't think so. If anyone thinks this post is negative and even depressing, needs help far beyond the capabilities of this board. I stated an opinion, based on past user patch frequency before and after the release of SM.
This post was meant to make people think a little bit. Sorry if the notion of independant thought upsets anyone.
ednrg, i enjoyed your thoughts and wish more people would speak openly whether its negative or just something positive they feel strongly about. As far as time management i find a bigger waste of guitar time sifting through the same mindless fluff that seems to spawn from those afraid to talk about stuff because it may be unpopular.
On this and many other threads going around, I keep hearing about \"right to my opinion\" and \"freedom of speech\" etc. Keep in mind that freedom of speech means freedom from government persecution and incarceration. That's it. It does not mean freedom from being fired, black-listed, or anything else - just ask the Dixie Chickens. Yes, we should have discussions about things that may be unpopular or even controversial, but people seem to have difficulty keeping emotions in check, and the \"discussion\" degrades into a fight. We're all on the same team here - I respect each and every one of you because hey, if you play guitar, you have to be cool 8) . If I wanted to hear fighting, I'd invite my inlaw's over for a BBQ :shock:
One thing great about this thread is that I don't think anyone has lost their temper and acted like a donkey. Very mature and respectful people here and thats great. Group hug everybody!
I don't have the Supermodels, yets, but I can't imagine that it has hurt the community. I have downloaded G3456's patches (and everyone else's) from the User patch forum, and I have found some of the patches to be very useful. I assume for most of us, music is a hobby or a side job. I have a regular job, pull down a good salary, and don't have time to do everything that I want to as a musician. Something like the Supermodels, or the User patches here, saves me a ton of time. It is quite simply a Godsend. I hope folks continue to develop patch. I will continue to download them. As long as guitarists are coming up with different tones, their fans, and bands who cover them, will want or need to find those tones.
When I hear a good patch I (which I might add has mostly been from the SM disc or updates) I have a look at the settings to get some idea of what's went into creating it for ideas for my own patches. So in effect the SM disc and updates actually motivate me to tweak more. Although I must admit my attempts usually end up sounding like they come from a one handed drunken hurdy gurdy player.
I also do not have the supermodels.
I would like to liken these patches to something like ammo for a gun. The ammo may make you gun have more range, higher muzzle velocity etc, but you still have to shoot it for yourself.
I whole heartedly agree with grathan in the sense that many people urge newcomers to spend more money on a disc, without actually helping them.
For the people who keep saying that we should be playing guitar while we are on here, get real, not everybody plays guitar 24 hours a day. I am a student and currently have about 3 hours spare time everyday. I still find time to do my assignments and all that, as well as play guitar and post on this forum.
...This post is antagonizing, negative, and depressing.. Go play your guitars....
Is it really? I don't think so. If anyone thinks this post is negative and even depressing, needs help far beyond the capabilities of this board. I stated an opinion, based on past user patch frequency before and after the release of SM.
This post was meant to make people think a little bit. Sorry if the notion of independant thought upsets anyone.
Hi all... For the record, I didn't think the TOPIC was antagonizing. I just thought that some of the content/tone and positioning as a bit negative/grandstanding. My personal feeling is that everyone should go down the path that has the most value to them , whether it be Supermodels, or not. I personally don't own them except for some of G3456's posted patches whcih I admit have been good starting points for some of my \"go to\" tones...But I feel absolutely fulfilled with the model aspect of the box( GNX) as-is...I think the effects aspect is a bit too rigid actually but anyway.... Oh jeez, I broke my 6-line limit... What a hypocrite I am...
Oh jeez, I broke my 6-line limit... What a hypocrite I am...
It's only four on my screen! :-D
Actually T L F you were somewhat of a pioneer of GNX3000... yours were the first samples of it that I heard in this community. Of course he won't see this since it's over six lines... the irony!
Personally I think such contributions are really best left to moments of inspiration, that way they are that much more appreciated by the folks here and make the community stronger.
Patch sharing isn't everything. There are many people who've done great job of putting together some really nice tunes, both originals and covers. We've also had some great discussion going on, and every day more people come out (here and elsewhere) helping each other create new sounds.
I don't think looking at ourselves from a bird's-eye-view is necessarily a negative thing - so long as it's not a bird-brained view. So how about this: commercial third-party patches have not so much hurt the community, rather they pushed its development into a new direction. Exact same thing may be said if Digitech decides to release new models for its users.
If patches based on the supermodels cannot be shared here, then their should be a supermodels forum where registered users can share patches. I would also like to share a backup x-edit file of all my patches on my gnx, but don't think that's possible because it contains mfx stuff.
It's wrong to blame G3456 for the forum dying. I think that the problem lies more in the organization and quality of the patches being provided. I am not ranting on those that submit patches because I can't make a good sounding patch and rather rely on taking another's patch and tweaking it. I'm just saying that there are alot of bad ones out there and nothing to distinguish them from the good ones.
The patches on the site are an unorganized mess (over a 1000 and no real order to them). I find that I spend more time searching though the list and getting nowhere fast rather than finding a good one and spend the time playing. Also I find that most of the patches are just set up without much tone in mind. Many are set with everything on 11 and even 12 in some cases and just sound like mega chainsaw distortion. Got tired and bored of flipping through the list, so I bought the SM disk and now rarely even look through the list to see what's new.
The SM disk is great. $65 well spent as now I'm playing more and farting around less with the GNX. The disk is organized and I can quickly get to where I want. The SM disk has amp models set up where you can add a few stomp boxes to them, maybe increase the gain to a level that you can tolerate and still have some decent tone leftover to use.
Just my 2 cents...sorry if I pissed anyone off, I don't mean to.
In my opinion. This was a really good post and obviously hit a nerve with some users of the forum. I was fairly nuetral on this subject until I considered what the original poster tried to convey. I understood completely but most didn't or perhaps didn't want to. I read the threads from the past and viewed the patches also and many points were made.
With all of the users who own GNX workstations - there are hardly any that post patches anymore- it is just obvious. Also I was counting how many times someone wanted to know how to adjust settings on a patch only to be directed to BUY the Supermodels, I stopped counting as this too was obvious after 20 times.
Then I was looking for the patches of \"tweaked\" Supermodels or originals that were posted and found maybe 10. Out of everyone that posts here, out of everyone that has GNXs there were only about 10. Simply boggled my mind that there were that few. Then I got to thinking.
And most will not like this and hopefully maturity will prevail in this discussion. Basically the Supermodels as far as I know are not \"endorsed\" by Digitech. Digitech owns no proprietary rights to the Supermodels. In plain sense they \"The Supermodels\" simply are a private party or entity or a service which is offered for a price. That service is the \"availabilty\" of a product. In lew of brevity and in all practical morality and ethics a determination must be made that for the \"good\" of the community endorsements of products not endorsed by Digitech or owned by Digtech should not be allowed to be posted or made in the forums. Especially when others are not given a fair chance or opportuntiy to endorse their products. Perhaps posts in regards to Products should be posted in a certain subject thread only and not be allowed to bombard every thread on every subject. Or perhaps users should be allowed to post any patch they see fit --- no matter where they got the patch from.
To make it easier to understand here is an analogy: Should the inventer of Electricity (Ben Franklin) be the sole owner of electricity and everyone including the electric companies pay him or his heirs for using electricity? Of cousrse not. We all have the ability to produce electricity if we choose to. Whether it be a generator or solar power it is free to use- but we CHOOSE to pay a private entity for a service No single person ownes electricity and no single person or entity has a right to tell someone they can't produce electricity as long as it is safe to do so- it is paid for by the means of delivery of the service. And there have been many improvents or \"tweaks\" to electrical power. Should Bill Gates be allowed to Monopolize the Pc industry? He tried to, but thats what the battle with the Govt. mainly was about and guess what? Microsoft lost-- because in the simplest terms One single individual or entity does not have a right to stiffle or hinder or purposely prioritize any other manufacturer or others looking to improve or change a product. The\"Ben Franklin\" clause was referenced and it made sense. Should others be allowed in a fair and decent way endorse their products or their improved Supermodels in these forums\"? Of course they should, because in a sense that is what the Supermodels are - they are improvements to Digitechs original presets. So to say no one is allowed to post a Supermodel patch is simply not fair and wrong. If this is the case and no one is allowed to post the Supermodel patches then the endorsements of said Supermodels in any form or in any way should be removed in all aspects from the forums and threads. The Supermodels are \"tweaks\" of Digitechs presets. It would be like Digitech saying- you are allowed to tweak the preset settings but dont let anyone know what you did and dont post your patches but you can give us money and we will adjust the settings for you. So who ownes the patches that are created and tweaked on the GNX units? Liike electricity and the internet, we all do.
great comments, but very hard to read.....paragraphs would be great. just a few lines at a time. sorry i'm not trying to be picky. but my eyes are not what they used to be...
Given that there is no endorsement by Digitech for the Supermodels, is it safe to assume there is no \"policing\" of patches as well? What exaclty would happen, by way of process, if someone did post a tweaked Supermodel?
Also, I tried to look at my own reasons on why I do or don't post a patch. I have tons and tons of them but I tend to only post a few. Of the patches I posted, they all tend to be unique ( At least to me and to my ears) and not available in any other form or forum, etc. I could go and post all my distortion patches ( That all of us already have) but all would have to sit and tweak anyway due to their own setup. A lot of my tweaks are for different guitars anyway os is there really a need for Metallica tone #372? I also have found the GNX3000 tones very good. Its not like when I had the RP or the GNX1, great products but I really needed the community patches to emulate some stuff. But this thing came equipped with a ton of usable models already and MOST of my needs were met extremely quickly. (But, ironically, as I said in a different post, one of my \"go to\" tones is, in fact, a derivative of a G3456 posted patch and one on of my own warped together. so I do think the community works.... )
All proprietors are expressly disallowed to \"endorse\" their products here. This applies to anything and includes the supermodels. Users of those products, however, can discuss these at leisure... once you get into who's allowed to post what where, and restricting people from making what they feel are relevant comments, sparks begin to fly. I think this has been made pretty clear time and again.
If you look earlier on this thread, you'll notice there's a link to a discussion where posting of these patches is addressed by the proprietor - also note that the forum where the post was made is not affiliated with DigiTech. No one ever said you can't post patches containing particular components developed by particular people, paid or otherwise. Furthermore, a proprietor could not possibly control this - after all, the posts are being made on the DigiTech forum, which you so aptly noted, does not endorse these products, supermodels in particular.
So I don't think anyone it's a problem... it's just an alternative to developing your own patches. Many users choose not to, for whatever reason - they might feel they are fully capable of doing so themselves, or they're just appalled at the idea of paying for patches.
Lest we forget the community is so much more than the creation and sharing of patches!
I have d'ld very few patches from the community even before I bought the SM disc. I can't actually remember the last time I checked the posted patches it was so long ago.
For me the community is a place where I can get advice on the GNX as well as music & music related subjects in general not to forget some of the \"banter\".
Yes I am guilty of mentioning the SM disc to posters who have never heard of them and are looking for other advice, only because I truthfully believe that they are a great product which actually enhance the GNX. I have nothing to gain by doing this and do not understand why anyone can have a problem with this.
IMO I do not think the SM series has damaged the community as downloading patches isn't why I'm here in the first place.
\"Hand him fish and you've fed him for a day. Teach him to fish and you've fed him for a lifetime.\"
methinks this could be interpreted in a number of ways relative to this thread - less members posting patches encourages others to tweak & create their own, or, SM Series is feeding them for a day?
If patches based on the supermodels cannot be shared here, then their should be a supermodels forum where registered users can share patches. I would also like to share a backup x-edit file of all my patches on my gnx, but don't think that's possible because it contains mfx stuff.
I suppose as follows :
A) The Supermodel stuff is also based on work by Digitech. The author claims they are made by warping existing factory models.
( You cant copyright something that is not your original work)
There is no way to prove/disprove that a particular patch contains stuff DIRECTLY from the Supermodel disk.
(There is no digital signature to reveal source of a patch)
C) There is no way to prove/disprove that a particular patch contains stuff warped from patches originally from the Supermodel disk.
(What if you warped 1% of a direct model with 99% of a Supermodel patch and got something that is extremely slightly different.)
D) Any patch/Amp/Cab in the Supermodel disk could also have been be created independantly by a user by himself warping existing factory models.
( Warping is open to all. You cannot copyright public knowledge
If you are presented by the exact same patch by two different sources, It is not possible to prove which one came from the Supermodels or from a patch poster's own warps)
E) There is no patent on the Supermodel disks.
(A patch is data for the programs in the GNX to analyse. I dont think that data is patentable or copyrightable
What if someone patented/copyrighted the number \"1\" and charged you to use it ? or requested you not to post \"1\" elsewhere ???
)
So it would appear from a legal standpoint, the request to not post patches from the Supermodels disk is not monitorable and not enforeable.
Infact such a request might dampen other patch posters who might be worried about a copyright infringement suit !! What happens if someone makes a patch and posts it and then there is a contention that a warp from some of the patches on the supermodel disk could have been used to create the newly posted patch ?
A) The Supermodel stuff is also based on work by Digitech. The author claims they are made by warping existing factory models.
Perhaps, but by the same logic you could also claim that any software is based on the work of the CPU manufacturer and therefore cannot be copyrighted. Or maybe we can say that using a particular digital processor results in plagiarism when you record your own song using it - after all, the sounds are not your own. So what exactly is the subject of our copyright here? I think it's a bit difficult to tell in such a situation.
Back in early 2000s, Microsoft tried to pull the \"patenting 1s and 0s\", claiming they own original texts where the system is first described in their library collection. It didn't fly, but they stood to make a lot of money if it had! Just goes to show that simply because something is common knowledge, does not mean people won't try to lay claims on it.
Comments
From a newcomers perspective...this is ONE SCARY community. Not because of the members, or occasional miscommunications, or bruised feelings. The depth of the technology is daunting, and the scope and grasp of will I or can I achieve a level of competance? You lay out lots of money wanting what the ADS say you'll have, but after you open the box, you begin to quickly realize you have gone WAY over your head!!! You feel like ....a dummy.
I have read responses from some members here, who have opened the box, and easily assimilated this tool into their gift of gear. There are people like me...who only in the last few years...FINALLY gave in and bought a computer....OMG. My first 6 months....strike that...my first year figuring out the computer was HELL for me...and sitting glued to the phone on hold for HOURS trying to undo my mistakes....or even ask the simple questions I could not grasp from a book. Maybe there are many lurkers out there with a feeling of being overwhelmed by this techno stuff too.
May I state...had I not come here with a thick skin...I would have been bruised away, early on. Along those lines....if a newcomer arrives and asks a question...and gets no response...even much less a WELCOME....thats as bad as a kik in the groin...or a dispairing emptiness.
I still do not understand much of what many of you have learned to take for granted. I am slacking off trying...because I have a few patches created by Dr. Mike and some others...and have tweeked a few ....and I'm presently just enjoying some basic success. I'll be hurting and embarrassing myself again soon, in an effort to advance. But, I at least feel closer to many people here, and confident I'll ask the right questions, and continue to develop some skills. I feel like the ugly little brother in the basement who gets the bucket of fishheads....so I joke around more. I can't offer much help GNX-wise...but I can assist in many other areas, or try to loosen a few ties around here.
That being my final point. Lets enjoy ourselves a tad bit...and reflect the joy music brings our lives. Be creative as well as critical. Realize...the tough love...or NO U Dummy...works when it's offered with pointing out the positive things with it...and ending on encouragement. Yes I think we should all benefit together...not struggle alone. But...I walk away from this thread realizing, and affirming...I need to read those tutorials and ask the questions, and develop the skills so maybe I can give something back in kind one day.
I don't mind saying either...I love you guys....like a brother. You ROCK !!
regards Manitou
The scientific method might show all 3 events mutually exclusive with a cause and effect theory invalid.
Is it really? I don't think so. If anyone thinks this post is negative and even depressing, needs help far beyond the capabilities of this board. I stated an opinion, based on past user patch frequency before and after the release of SM.
This post was meant to make people think a little bit. Sorry if the notion of independant thought upsets anyone.
I would like to liken these patches to something like ammo for a gun. The ammo may make you gun have more range, higher muzzle velocity etc, but you still have to shoot it for yourself.
I whole heartedly agree with grathan in the sense that many people urge newcomers to spend more money on a disc, without actually helping them.
For the people who keep saying that we should be playing guitar while we are on here, get real, not everybody plays guitar 24 hours a day. I am a student and currently have about 3 hours spare time everyday. I still find time to do my assignments and all that, as well as play guitar and post on this forum.
Hi all... For the record, I didn't think the TOPIC was antagonizing. I just thought that some of the content/tone and positioning as a bit negative/grandstanding. My personal feeling is that everyone should go down the path that has the most value to them , whether it be Supermodels, or not. I personally don't own them except for some of G3456's posted patches whcih I admit have been good starting points for some of my \"go to\" tones...But I feel absolutely fulfilled with the model aspect of the box( GNX) as-is...I think the effects aspect is a bit too rigid actually but anyway.... Oh jeez, I broke my 6-line limit... What a hypocrite I am...
Actually T L F you were somewhat of a pioneer of GNX3000... yours were the first samples of it that I heard in this community. Of course he won't see this since it's over six lines... the irony!
Personally I think such contributions are really best left to moments of inspiration, that way they are that much more appreciated by the folks here and make the community stronger.
Patch sharing isn't everything. There are many people who've done great job of putting together some really nice tunes, both originals and covers. We've also had some great discussion going on, and every day more people come out (here and elsewhere) helping each other create new sounds.
I don't think looking at ourselves from a bird's-eye-view is necessarily a negative thing - so long as it's not a bird-brained view. So how about this: commercial third-party patches have not so much hurt the community, rather they pushed its development into a new direction. Exact same thing may be said if Digitech decides to release new models for its users.
The patches on the site are an unorganized mess (over a 1000 and no real order to them). I find that I spend more time searching though the list and getting nowhere fast rather than finding a good one and spend the time playing. Also I find that most of the patches are just set up without much tone in mind. Many are set with everything on 11 and even 12 in some cases and just sound like mega chainsaw distortion. Got tired and bored of flipping through the list, so I bought the SM disk and now rarely even look through the list to see what's new.
The SM disk is great. $65 well spent as now I'm playing more and farting around less with the GNX. The disk is organized and I can quickly get to where I want. The SM disk has amp models set up where you can add a few stomp boxes to them, maybe increase the gain to a level that you can tolerate and still have some decent tone leftover to use.
Just my 2 cents...sorry if I pissed anyone off, I don't mean to.
With all of the users who own GNX workstations - there are hardly any that post patches anymore- it is just obvious. Also I was counting how many times someone wanted to know how to adjust settings on a patch only to be directed to BUY the Supermodels, I stopped counting as this too was obvious after 20 times.
Then I was looking for the patches of \"tweaked\" Supermodels or originals that were posted and found maybe 10. Out of everyone that posts here, out of everyone that has GNXs there were only about 10. Simply boggled my mind that there were that few. Then I got to thinking.
And most will not like this and hopefully maturity will prevail in this discussion. Basically the Supermodels as far as I know are not \"endorsed\" by Digitech. Digitech owns no proprietary rights to the Supermodels. In plain sense they \"The Supermodels\" simply are a private party or entity or a service which is offered for a price. That service is the \"availabilty\" of a product. In lew of brevity and in all practical morality and ethics a determination must be made that for the \"good\" of the community endorsements of products not endorsed by Digitech or owned by Digtech should not be allowed to be posted or made in the forums. Especially when others are not given a fair chance or opportuntiy to endorse their products. Perhaps posts in regards to Products should be posted in a certain subject thread only and not be allowed to bombard every thread on every subject. Or perhaps users should be allowed to post any patch they see fit --- no matter where they got the patch from.
To make it easier to understand here is an analogy: Should the inventer of Electricity (Ben Franklin) be the sole owner of electricity and everyone including the electric companies pay him or his heirs for using electricity? Of cousrse not. We all have the ability to produce electricity if we choose to. Whether it be a generator or solar power it is free to use- but we CHOOSE to pay a private entity for a service No single person ownes electricity and no single person or entity has a right to tell someone they can't produce electricity as long as it is safe to do so- it is paid for by the means of delivery of the service. And there have been many improvents or \"tweaks\" to electrical power. Should Bill Gates be allowed to Monopolize the Pc industry? He tried to, but thats what the battle with the Govt. mainly was about and guess what? Microsoft lost-- because in the simplest terms One single individual or entity does not have a right to stiffle or hinder or purposely prioritize any other manufacturer or others looking to improve or change a product. The\"Ben Franklin\" clause was referenced and it made sense. Should others be allowed in a fair and decent way endorse their products or their improved Supermodels in these forums\"? Of course they should, because in a sense that is what the Supermodels are - they are improvements to Digitechs original presets. So to say no one is allowed to post a Supermodel patch is simply not fair and wrong. If this is the case and no one is allowed to post the Supermodel patches then the endorsements of said Supermodels in any form or in any way should be removed in all aspects from the forums and threads. The Supermodels are \"tweaks\" of Digitechs presets. It would be like Digitech saying- you are allowed to tweak the preset settings but dont let anyone know what you did and dont post your patches but you can give us money and we will adjust the settings for you. So who ownes the patches that are created and tweaked on the GNX units? Liike electricity and the internet, we all do.
Also, I tried to look at my own reasons on why I do or don't post a patch. I have tons and tons of them but I tend to only post a few. Of the patches I posted, they all tend to be unique ( At least to me and to my ears) and not available in any other form or forum, etc. I could go and post all my distortion patches ( That all of us already have) but all would have to sit and tweak anyway due to their own setup. A lot of my tweaks are for different guitars anyway os is there really a need for Metallica tone #372? I also have found the GNX3000 tones very good. Its not like when I had the RP or the GNX1, great products but I really needed the community patches to emulate some stuff. But this thing came equipped with a ton of usable models already and MOST of my needs were met extremely quickly. (But, ironically, as I said in a different post, one of my \"go to\" tones is, in fact, a derivative of a G3456 posted patch and one on of my own warped together. so I do think the community works.... )
If you look earlier on this thread, you'll notice there's a link to a discussion where posting of these patches is addressed by the proprietor - also note that the forum where the post was made is not affiliated with DigiTech. No one ever said you can't post patches containing particular components developed by particular people, paid or otherwise. Furthermore, a proprietor could not possibly control this - after all, the posts are being made on the DigiTech forum, which you so aptly noted, does not endorse these products, supermodels in particular.
So I don't think anyone it's a problem... it's just an alternative to developing your own patches. Many users choose not to, for whatever reason - they might feel they are fully capable of doing so themselves, or they're just appalled at the idea of paying for patches.
I have d'ld very few patches from the community even before I bought the SM disc. I can't actually remember the last time I checked the posted patches it was so long ago.
For me the community is a place where I can get advice on the GNX as well as music & music related subjects in general not to forget some of the \"banter\".
Yes I am guilty of mentioning the SM disc to posters who have never heard of them and are looking for other advice, only because I truthfully believe that they are a great product which actually enhance the GNX. I have nothing to gain by doing this and do not understand why anyone can have a problem with this.
IMO I do not think the SM series has damaged the community as downloading patches isn't why I'm here in the first place.
This is true, but it use to be a very large part of the board.
\"Hand him fish and you've fed him for a day. Teach him to fish and you've fed him for a lifetime.\"
methinks this could be interpreted in a number of ways relative to this thread - less members posting patches encourages others to tweak & create their own, or, SM Series is feeding them for a day?
I suppose as follows :
A) The Supermodel stuff is also based on work by Digitech. The author claims they are made by warping existing factory models.
( You cant copyright something that is not your original work)
(There is no digital signature to reveal source of a patch)
C) There is no way to prove/disprove that a particular patch contains stuff warped from patches originally from the Supermodel disk.
(What if you warped 1% of a direct model with 99% of a Supermodel patch and got something that is extremely slightly different.)
D) Any patch/Amp/Cab in the Supermodel disk could also have been be created independantly by a user by himself warping existing factory models.
( Warping is open to all. You cannot copyright public knowledge
If you are presented by the exact same patch by two different sources, It is not possible to prove which one came from the Supermodels or from a patch poster's own warps)
E) There is no patent on the Supermodel disks.
(A patch is data for the programs in the GNX to analyse. I dont think that data is patentable or copyrightable
What if someone patented/copyrighted the number \"1\" and charged you to use it ? or requested you not to post \"1\" elsewhere ???
)
So it would appear from a legal standpoint, the request to not post patches from the Supermodels disk is not monitorable and not enforeable.
Infact such a request might dampen other patch posters who might be worried about a copyright infringement suit !! What happens if someone makes a patch and posts it and then there is a contention that a warp from some of the patches on the supermodel disk could have been used to create the newly posted patch ?
TY
shando
Back in early 2000s, Microsoft tried to pull the \"patenting 1s and 0s\", claiming they own original texts where the system is first described in their library collection. It didn't fly, but they stood to make a lot of money if it had! Just goes to show that simply because something is common knowledge, does not mean people won't try to lay claims on it.