G4 external buttons use

maxifox

Hello, all

Can anyone give an advice what is the best approach in using of external buttons on G4 TPs? For what do you use them: navigation inside the pages, "qick" links, volume control..?

I understand dependancy on the project needs and difference arised between wall-mounted and wireless panels, but what are the general ideas?

Thomas Hayes

Hi Maxifox,
I usually use the buttons for common fuctions such as volume control, channel up/down control, system on/off. Mostly for convienance to the user instead of having to locate the page.

maxifox

Thank you, Thomas. The question arised because I am a bit confused with wall-mounted panels especially one near entrance. I feel that volume control is not needed (?) there, so the buttons might be used for something else... Hmmm, just not sure I am right...

Thomas Hayes

Hi Maxifox
If the panel is near the main entrance then maybe use them for system off , basic lighting controls, alarm system on or even a call for a sub-routine that will turn the lights on in different rooms, maybe the TV, stereo, etc if your client will be out after dark to help prevent B&E's.

DHawthorne

Since they are global, I reserve them for functions you always need available no matter what page you are on - almost without exception vol +/- and channel +/- for the left side buttons, and your basic source navigations on the right-side array.

Funny thing, several of my customers do not like the hardware buttons, and want those functions duplicated on the screens (which kind of defeats the purpose). I generally have to label the left buttons with text on the side of the screen too. Although after using the things for a while it becomes second nature, they often get confused in the beginning which is which.

maxifox

Thanks. This is exactly what I am thinking about... Just needed some clarification from experienced guys that I am not doing wrong things...

Rob Whapham

Originally posted by DHawthorne
Since they are global, I reserve them for functions you always need available no matter what page you are on...

Actually, for G4 panels, the external button configurations do not have to be just global. The functionality of individual buttons can be overridden on a page-by-page basis. This makes it easy, for instance, on an MVP panel to have the left-side buttons controlling global functions like volume and/or lighting, but have the right-hand left/right/up/down/select buttons change based upon the current device page so they can control the proper device without the need to do page tracking or a similar trick in NetLinx code.

To accomplish this, with the desired page open, choose Page->Show External Controls (or press CTRL+B). Then select the desired button(s) to override for this specific page. Then simply change the general 'Override Global Settings' property from 'no' to 'yes'. You will then be able to change the button's configuration and it will apply only when the panel is displaying that page.

Spire_Jeff

On the wall mount panels. I use the external buttons mainly for volume and some quick jump pages. For example, one button jumps to local lighting control, one button jumps to a quick functions page (execute goodbye sequence, arm alarm home, turn off all audio/video zones in basement....) and a link to a status page(current hvac settings by room, lighting status, a/v status....)

On the wireless panels, I use the left buttons for channel and volume, and the right buttons for device menu navigations.

But, the most important thing to remember is that regarding issues such as this, there is not necessarily a right way and a wrong way. There may be 50 different ways to do it and have it function properly, but you need to talk with the person(s) using the panel and find out which way makes the most sense to them.

Jeff

jeffaco

I do this all the time, but ...

To accomplish this, with the desired page open, choose Page->Show External Controls (or press CTRL+B). Then select the desired button(s) to override for this specific page. Then simply change the general 'Override Global Settings' property from 'no' to 'yes'. You will then be able to change the button's configuration and it will apply only when the panel is displaying that page.

I do this all the time, but as I recall, it's problematic.

If you do this, it works. But if you the copy that page, then the external buttons get really screwed up. For example, right now with my panel file, I have no global settings for the top two left buttons on the MVP-8400 (they're all set by page). However, if I look at properties for a page, it says that I haven't override the global settings for the page. That's not right ...

I thought/hoped this would be fixed in TPDesign4 v2.4, but that does not appear to be the case (unless I need to do something to my panel file, anyway, to "fix" this up).

Anyone have further information on this issue/bug?

Rob Whapham

Re: I do this all the time, but ...

Originally posted by jeffaco
I thought/hoped this would be fixed in TPDesign4 v2.4, but that does not appear to be the case (unless I need to do something to my panel file, anyway, to "fix" this up).

Anyone have further information on this issue/bug?

There is, unfortunately, no easy way to fix existing files with external control problems. But, we do believe that we have addressed all outstanding issues when creating new external control configurations.

My suggestion is to try setting all overriden external controls to use the global settings, and then re-override and set up their functionality again.

Irvine_Kyle

I'd Like to add that ever since I started using the cursor buttons on the right side of the MVPs I refuse to even but navigation arrows on the actual panel. Kudos to engineering for that one. That was one of the most maddening experiences, trying to create consistent arrows for navigation BAH!

mediapilotinc

I understand that the default mode for the right side pad is to manouver a mouse in G4Computer Control. I like to use this mouse function when the customer is browsing his/her computer, but also need to use these same buttons to navigate through the DSS's guide when the selected (the latter part easy to track and code). Noticed that once you override the button's default operation, mouse control is no longer an option (nor could I find a way to create it from code).

Does anybody have a suggestion?

Spannertech

More than one of my customers has remarked that the external buttons don't have very good "feel" - especially the right side 4 way thing. I somewhat agree with them - just doesn't feel right. Up/down/left/right arrows are becoming very dominant as a way of controlling things (think Tivos and DVD menus) so it's good that it's there. But I wish it felt better.

Joe Hebert

Originally posted by mediapilotinc
Noticed that once you override the button's default operation, mouse control is no longer an option (nor could I find a way to create it from code). Does anybody have a suggestion?

Hi mediapilontinc,

If you select yes to override global settings you can do the following:

From the programming tab, select 0-setup port as the Channel Port.

Click the down arrow on the Channel Code property and at the very bottom of the drop down click on Advanced Codes The drop down will refresh with several new options and one of them is Computer Control. Inside of Computer Control are your mouse and scrolling options.

Is this what you?re looking for?

Joe

mediapilotinc

Joe,

Thanks for your suggestion, but I'm afraid that is not exactely what I am looking for. Let me try and clarify it:
Depending on the selected source, I want those buttons to perform a different task. So if the DSS is selected, I want to use the pad to the right to navigate the guide menu (button channel will trigger an event in code which will in turn send IR or RS232 data to the DSS box). If the PC is selected, I want to use the same pad to control the mouse movements (mouse movements, not cusor selections, etc) within G4CC.

This requires that the mouse movement functions are selected from code, not hard-coded in the panel. A scenario where the functions control the mouse and send a channel code at the same time might work as well, as long as G4CC can be disabled while DSS etc. is selected.

Joe Hebert

Originally posted by mediapilotinc
Depending on the selected source, I want those buttons to perform a different task.

Are you saying that Computer Control and DSS control will be on the same TP page? If they are, then I'm afraid I don't have an answer. I've never seen a commad to allow the functions you are looking for via code. Doesn't mean there isn't one, I just don't know what it is.

Do you have the option to create a seperate page for Computer Control and DSS? If you do. then you can assign whatever functions you want at design time for each page.

Sorry I couldn't have been more help.

Joe

mediapilotinc

Thanks Joe,

Never noticed those buttons could have a different function depending on the page shown inside. This opens up a lot of options!

Thanks again,

Joe Hebert

You're welcome, Wilbert. Glad to help.

Joe

DHawthorne

Originally posted by mediapilotinc
Joe,

Thanks for your suggestion, but I'm afraid that is not exactely what I am looking for. Let me try and clarify it:
Depending on the selected source, I want those buttons to perform a different task. So if the DSS is selected, I want to use the pad to the right to navigate the guide menu (button channel will trigger an event in code which will in turn send IR or RS232 data to the DSS box). If the PC is selected, I want to use the same pad to control the mouse movements (mouse movements, not cusor selections, etc) within G4CC.

This requires that the mouse movement functions are selected from code, not hard-coded in the panel. A scenario where the functions control the mouse and send a channel code at the same time might work as well, as long as G4CC can be disabled while DSS etc. is selected.

I do this kind of thing by tracking my source, then putting a switch statement based on that source in the PUSH event for those buttons. Depending on what switch leg is taken, different events for different sources can occur, and it need not be limited to any one type of event (IR vs. RS-232, etc.). I'm not so sure about applying it to Computer Control though - if there was a numerical reference to the commands on the setup port, I would suggest trying the DO_PUSH function, but I don't know how to translate the setup port functions to a channel code.

Reese Jacobs

G4 external buttons use

Dave,

I have been down the road with Tech Support regarding sending (and receiving) channel events for setup codes. There are actually (at least) two ways to see the actual numeric channel code associated with a setup function:

1. Assign the setup function to a button and then change the port without changing the channel and the channel will change from the named function to its numeric equivalent (which is most likely meaningless on the newly selected port).

2. A second (and easier) way is to refer to the Excel worksheet that AMX provides as part of the TPDesign 4 installation package. In the Common Files\AMXShare\G4SupportFiles\PPFs directory, there is a file called SetupCodes.xls which documents all of the codes supported on all of the G4 panels. Pretty handy little document.

I talked to Tech Support about trying to use the setup codes to turn Modero docking station LEDs off and on but was told that not only are the channels not reported in CHANNEL_EVENTS, you can not DO_PUSH() to activate them. I believe I tested and verified this with a CHANNEL_EVENT and they were correct. It would be nice if these behaved the same as other channels but my understanding is that they do not so I don't think that is an option in the G4 control case noted earlier in the thread.

Reese

DHawthorne

DO_PUSH doesn't work with all virtuals, so that is probably what is going on. I remember at one time having some idea of what you could use it for, and what you couldn't, but it has fled me...and I am sure it is related to the inability to pass constants to a module; there is a timing issue in how some things are initialized and it affects the event table construction.

Ah well, it was a thought .